Most memorable moment?

[Judge Sam]

What one event in the game stands out as the most memorable or dramatic moment?


For me, when I think about the game as a whole, it'd probably be the entrance of the 11 Intruders. The game was so different in the first two episodes with 15 to 11 people. Bringing in 11 more really shook things up. Also maybe the events of the very last day. I didn't think the last episode at all was going to be interesting but it turned out to be the most interesting strategical one of them all.

[Tenchi]

Right on Sam.

I thought it was going to be a boring final episode when the prime suspects were Arthur, Matthew and Brooks. When my name came up, I was like "holy cow!!!" and I REALLY didn't know what to do. Raphael even asked me on what to do and I just said, "I don't know". I was really panicking. Yeah, I think the Spy Chatroom where we planned to ambush Bruce and Matthew to get their vote was awesome, strategically. I thought it was a perfect ending for this game (us winning of course).

If I was going to pick another memorable moment, it would be the Bunker fiasco. It was funny in a way since we knew Jack was defending a spy and it was even funnier when all of the Citizens cleared spies Jessica and me when they "made the numbers fit".

[Carrie]

Yeah, how you and Jessica escaped pretty much all suspicion while Jenn was exiled still baffles me.

[Tenchi]

lol Oh yeah, who was the leader of Jenn's Exile? It was not me, I know. I just supported it. ><

But I know we got away since we were part of Annie's voting group, Jessica on one side, me on the other. Annie and the other Cits do not want to give up the voting power they have since they can pretty much Exile anybody with a voting block of five (plus a few more inactive citizens).

[Bebe]

The most memorable moment to me was winning the second challenge.

Tenchi, Claire, Jessica, and I were working together to ensure that the team of Jessica/Claire/Matthew would win the challenge. We figured that Jessica and Claire could totally take Matthew on in the next round, while Tenchi and I didn't really want to go up against our intimidatingly intelligent teammates.

But Brooks absolutely refused to give his piece to anyone, which blew that idea to pieces. So after freaking out in the Spy Chat (LOL poor Tenchi - sorry again, babe), I just said "Fuck it, my team will take the win and I'll take on Miles and Bruce."

The next round in the challenge went so smoothly - I just couldn't believe how easy it was to win the investigation.

The "congrats" reception in the Spy HQ was pretty awesome.

[Claire]

it's a good thing we didn't win esp. with the theory that the winning team had 2 spyz in it.

[Bebe]

I don't know if it mattered that much. Other than Reicheru, no one really seemed to care about the challenge details. After Miles' exile, it's not like people were really emphasizing that Bruce or I or both HAD to be a Spy. Remember, Tenchi got the final votes.

[Claire]

i know but there's no telling what matthew would've done esp. with his craziness. but with there not being a confirmed on our team i think it would've effected who go voted for this exile or the last b/c i'm sure rei was thinking about it prior to the last round.

[Reicheru]

I think you did awesome, Bebe, but from that point on, as far as I was sold on anyone, I was sold on you. Still couldn't get you out though.

Most memorable moment for me: Hmmm... Sam told me to keep things "PG" in an early confessional. (It's the one with the pork-bellied cyclops quote.) And I responded that you're allowed three uses of the word "fuck" in a PG film. Then I went and sent a certain Private Message with NINE "fucks" in it, and I was like, "FUCK!!"

(Damn, that's three "Fucks" all in one paragraph. Fuck.)

But seriously... after all the trouble I'd taken to protect everyone I trusted from imprisonment (especially Tenchi and Jessica, LOL), to then have Anneliese post to the world about her ability... I couldn't believe it. I just could not believe it. I felt sick to my stomach.

And if you have ANY plans for becoming a citizen in Spies 4, just remember Spies 1, where the citizens won easily with hardly any revealing information being posted in the Burg. And remember Spies 2, where I made such good use of the Burg myself (ably assisted by Trina and Bebe - Davoni and Adriana that were - thanks guys!) as a spy. And think: THE BURG IS NOT YOUR FRIEND! THE BURG IS YOUR ENEMY! IT WILL STEAL YOUR WOMEN AND EAT YOUR CHILDREN! DO NOT TRUST THE BURG!

[Tenchi]

But didn't the Burg help in the campaign for the ousting of Tenchi and Bebe, and even Jessica? Its just that there are a million and one things items out there in the Burg and they didnt believe the best ones.

[Judge Sam]

I said PG-13. And I don't care about swear words, there is nothing inherently wrong with the words 'fuck' 'shit' or 'bloody bastard'. I disagree with the Burg comment for several reasons though:


1) Once one Spy knows something, all Spies know it. The Spies knew pretty much everything already, so spreading information to the remaining Citizens is beneficial.


2) The more theories and suspicions that are aired and spoken, the better. It's hard to transmit all of those one by one in AIM conversations, and even then it's harder to remember them. Posting in the Burg allows you to speak to everyone all at once as well as have a record of it.


3) In 99.9% of online mafia games, the entire game takes place in the "Burg." The entire game takes place publicly in one thread where people debate the identities of players. (how in the world someone can tell that someone is part of an enemy team simply through their carefully-worded posts in one thread blows my mind personally though). But it works for them, so there's no reason why it can't be incorporated here.

[Reicheru]

Tenchi - I seem to recall that you and Bebe rode on to glorious victory despite all the stuff in the Burg. Maybe if Jack had kept his Bebe ideas under wraps and we'd just discussed them with people who could be relied upon, the spies would have been unaware of them and they wouldn't have been dismissed so easily.

Sam - this is Britain, remember? No PG-13! Or at least there didn't used to be.

And this isn't exactly your run-of-the-mill Mafia game. Things like www.crywolfgame.com take place over the space of twenty minutes or so. This thing takes over a MONTH. There's a huge difference in scale.

As for the spies "knowing everything", in Spies 1 everything was kept private. The spies never had a clue who the counteragents were (I seem to remember them imprisoning me thinking I was one!) and got the Psychic exiled purely by good luck, not knowing his importance. What's more, it took us - or rather Soraya, who practically won the whole thing herself anyway after I went! - FIVE ROUNDS to get every single spy. That was with the Burg hardly being utilised at all.

In Spies 2, you had a HUGE raft of conversations being posted (including the fake ones me and Allison had taken the trouble to knock up beforehand, long before it occurred to anyone else bar possibly Judge Sam that we would need to. YES, WE WERE THAT FUCKING GOOD. ) We had the "calling out" thread, that pretty much led to Davoni's exile (and while I never planned or wanted Davoni to go at the point she did, I was at least VERY encouraging of both Davoni's efforts to "save" Tiffany and make herself more of an outcast, and Adriana's unreasonable suspicions of her. It was like Brer Rabbit - the more I protested, the more Adriana thought I was deluded. Not exactly planned, but it worked out pretty well for us spies, thank you very much!) You had a load of "suspicion lists", with myself at the bottom of most of them (and if Leo hadn't have gone and posted me and Ally in the dead centre of his, which Nicole picked up on in about two seconds flat but luckily nobody was listening to her then anyway, they would have been outright helpful to the spies.)

In a game this size, burg posts tend to transmit nothing but information overload. I don't think they can do any good. With a super-aggressive spy - which was my ultimate nightmare in this game, realized perfectly by Tenchi - they can do an incredible amount of harm. And most of the roles were discovered by the spies (ok, Bebe!) before they were given out in the Burg anyway.

Finally, one more point about Spies 2.

When Adriana, AKA Bebe, made a point about "knowing who helped to win the game" and that others besides Karl and Rodney should be considered winners, I respectfully but wholeheartedly disagreed. I still disagree, and here's why:

1) Who was most responsible for Leo's exile? Obviously the Evil Mutant Pancake alliance (God DAMN I wanted to be an EMP!) but, out of all of them, I'd say Nicole had the most sway. She was the one most actively campaigning for votes, and she and Davoni were the ones who first approached me.

Who else? Karl suspected Leo the most out of the "Adriana group" just before Leo was exiled. As far as I can recall, he and Tiffany both wanted to use her "gambler" power for Leo's exile. Tiffany was also an ally of Davoni and Nicole at the time. So of the four people I'd consider most responsible for Leo's exile - Nicole, Karl, Davoni and Tiffany - two made it to the final round.

(There's a metaphor I used about Judith's exile, which I think works well here too. If you start a boulder rolling down a mountain, you can't escape responsibility if it picks up a few loose rocks along the way. Judith's exile was my boulder. Tenchi and Anneliese said - or at least Tenchi claimed - they wanted to exile Jenn. Unfortunately I handed Tenchi a golden opportunity on a plate, and he didn't waste it!)

Now who was responsible for Allison's exile? OK, you could say that I was... but Nicole, Karl and Rodney had three votes between them. That's almost a majority at that point. And can any of you seriously see Anna having organised that exile herself? Derek, yes, he would probably have taken out Allison at that point anyway... but Anna, no way.

As regards my own exile, without wanting to blow my own horn too much here, let's remind any Spies-wannabes of a few facts:

1) Nobody other than Rodney, Karl and Nicole had any serious suspicions of me before the finale. Rodney had pretty much dismissed me by the time the Private Investigator arrived in episode nine, and put me at the very bottom of his spy list. Karl, who was eventually the ringleader in exiling me, NEVER TOLD ANYONE OF HIS SUSPICIONS UNTIL THEN. Had he done so, he probably wouldn't have been believed, and I could refute them and possibly imprison him. You can't defend against an attack you don't see coming.

2) Nobody EVER voted for me before the finale. There are still only two spies in the history of the series who can claim this - Raphael (who never received a single vote from anyone the entire game - nice one!) and myself.

Not only did nobody vote for me, nobody considered voting for me. Nobody considered me a possibility. In Episode 2 Rodney was still suspicious of me enough to consider trying to get me out, but he never actually did anything about it, and after that I dropped off his suspicion list completely until the very end.

Considering those two facts, how do you think anything posted in the Burg could possibly have helped the citizens exile me? It didn't and couldn't, pure and simple. Karl's suspicions of me were entirely private, and him keeping them private allowed him to last long enough to get into a position to actually use them and snatch victory away from me at the last second. The conversations I posted were faked. Other people posted crucial information about roles that could have helped us imprison Tiffany, Rashma, Jenna and Adriana one after another. (The citizens couldn't have known then that we already knew about Jenna's role, in particular. Only a few people did.)

Let's compare Jack and Karl. Jack suspects Bebe, posts his suspicions of her IN THE BURG, gets engaged in conversation by her, sees her defended by several people (mostly other spies), and changes his mind. Bebe lives on. Jack is exiled the next round.

Karl suspects Tyson, doesn't say a word to anyone he doesn't trust, isn't perceived as a threat, acts when he needs to act, and wins the game.

So to summarize this rather lengthy post:

Spies 1 - Burg hardly utilised. Roles kept private, safelists kept between the safe. The cits influence the votes in the same way as the spies do, working undercover in small groups, and end up owning the spies.

Spies 2 - Burg most instrumental in assuring the exile of Davoni and the imprisonment of Adriana, Tiffany and Jenna. Has nothing whatsoever to do with Leo's exile (which was done via PMs and IM conversations), Allison's exile (which was inevitable at that point) or Tyson's exile (which was carried out completely privately - you might remember that the very last Burg post actually advised Rodney and I to vote Karl off. Wish we'd taken notice of that one!)

Spies 3 - THREE roles are posted in the burg, as is a public safelist that nobody actually trusts. Probably more was posted in the Burg this time, conversations excepted, than in any previous Spies game, and what happens? The spies win by landslide.

So Sam - all I can say is, knowing how the first three Spies games have turned out, if you seriously think any amount of public posting can help the citizens win, you must be seriously deluded about what's happened in your own games. The only people who have EVER been helped by public "outings" are the spies. Not once has a spy ever been exiled because of something posted in the burg. Not once.

[Trina]

Jeezus...this is why I'm not right for this game lol. I can never be as analytical and smart in breaking things down like that ^^

you guys should apply on real reality mafia games <_<

[Jessica]

I'm gonna have to agree with Sam. Posting in the burg DOES help tremendously. There is no such thing as information overload. If someone can't hold a certain amount of information, they probably wont be able to win anyway.

Judging strictly by this game, had people posted in the burg earlier on, we would have had a much harder time. There were quite a few people we blindsided, or only learned of their fate minutes before exile. Had people publicly discussed their votes beforehand, people like Jakub and Judy, who seem like amazing players to me, would have very likely been able to defend themselves. And when people can successfully defend themselves, it means they are able to strike back at the people who threw suspicion onto them. So if people could have defended themselves successfully, people like me with 50,000 majority votes would have been screwed.

As for spies 1, it seemed to me that in a game with two counteragents, there is absolutely no drawback to keeping everything private since there would be this huge group of people who are all privately confirmed anyway.

I just think that even if there is a privately confirmed group, they shouldn't hinder all info in the burg. There is no reason why they can't express their suspects in the burg, unless revealing suspects would give away your private safelist.

[Reicheru]

As for spies 1, it seemed to me that in a game with two counteragents, there is absolutely no drawback to keeping everything private since there would be this huge group of people who are all privately confirmed anyway.

Actually I THINK only three people were officially "confirmed" by a counteragent: DJ, Gindi and Frank. DJ I never knew or thought was a citizen, and it really surprised me when he was, but the other two I never suspected from very early on.

In fact, when I was imprisoned in round four, I had narrowed down the suspects to five possibles: Monica, DJ, Caroline, Mercedes and Julian. That means I'd effectively eliminated Josh, Emma, Soraya, Gindi, Marion and Frank without the help of a counteragent (since I was never told for definite who the CAs were). If I'd known about the investigations I would only have had three suspects: Caroline, Mercedes and Julian. The last two were the spies.

In other words, what you had was a lot of different groups of citizens, each with different ideas. Gigi, the first spy to be exiled, was suspected for many different reasons by many different people. In the end the reasons were irrelevant though - she was a spy. I think that's what was missing here. It's easier to follow a bandwagon if everyone else is publicly doing the same thing. Easier to make up your own mind if you have only yourself and your allies to depend on, and history shows you're more likely to get it right that way.

Tenchi and Jessica used the Burg (and, it has to be said, Arthur) to accuse Jack. Bebe used Jack's burg posting against her for her own benefit, getting the spies to turn it around. Anneliese's builder post nearly got me exiled, and her subsequent retraction practically cleared Tenchi and Jessica for a while. And think what would have happened, Jessica, if any citizen had posted a serious suspicion of you or Tenchi (which is really the only thing they could have posted that early on) - they'd probably have been suspected because of it, because a lot of other citizens, including me, would've disagreed. I doubt it would have hurt you at all.

(OK let me rephrase this bit...) Jessica and Sam, what do you think the citizens could post that would help them get a spy, or spies, out? Straight away I would eliminate SUSPICIONS (if someone is so much suspected that a majority of citizens would agree, they're probably going to get exiled anyway like Gigi Julian and Leo were, and if not then the person who posted the theory would probably come under more suspicion than the person suspected, which has happened twice in Spies 3 alone); ROLES, for obvious reasons; and THEORIES (because nobody seems to analyze them properly. See Jack's exile for a prime example of this.) So what could you post, as a citizen, that would help the citizens win?

[Tenchi]

First and foremost, I AGREE WITH TRINA. Reicheru should get paid for the lengthy and analytical posts. If they have a reality show like this, you should apply. I cannot do that much of talking/typing. ><

I would have to disagree on Jack's Post being useless/ not analyzed properly. I think it was a matter of wording in Jack's case and his likeability in the Burg that hurt him. First, Jack is suspected by many very early since he acts shady and spy-like, does not go on AIM as often as the spies do, and does not really make good social (non-game) relations. So when he posted his suspicions on AIM, his previous reputation did him more harm than good.

And when it was Jack's word vs Tenchi's, Tenchi was a better character and personality, he is more likely to be believed. Not only that, comparing my Burg campaign against Jack's, my wording was simple and bulleted. Jack's campaign was wordy and mathematical (somehow a boring read).

[Jessica]

I guess there are pros and cons to both approaches when it comes to mostly public vs mostly private. This has been my first mostly private game as where i come from 99% of info is posted publicly, so I may be biased. I would love to play as a citizen in a game that is mostly private, just to see what it is like, but my tested and true method for my play style is mostly public.

[Reicheru]

I would have to disagree on Jack's Post being useless/ not analyzed properly.

I really don't see how- although I'll agree you did a stellar job in disproving it yourself, Tenchi! At the time Jack accused Bebe, Anneliese's post in the Burg made it perfectly clear that she hadn't received any actual numbers of bunker posts until a full episode after Jack could have "faked" one. It also made it clear that as far as she knew, she was only going to be told whether or not the bunker had collapsed, and only HAD been told that up until then.

If Jack thought the post counts wouldn't be revealed to Anneliese, he simply had no reason whatsoever to "fake" a post. QED.

And there were other reasons to suspect Bebe as well, primarily because the spies would want to win that investigation at all costs, and she did. That, for me, was killer.

Then, for me personally, there was the fact that she was willing to let me believe that she was the Gift Giver - she did explain this by saying she was protecting Taylor. But I never quite bought into that, and it always seemed to me that the most simple explanation was that she, as a spy, knew she was running no risk of imprisonment and wanted me to protect her from exile.

hen there was her suspicion of me - which seemed fake - and the fact that she claimed to have a good idea who I was (since I suspected who she was also, I could easily believe this) and yet still suspected me. Did she really think Sam would choose the same spy twice in a row? I didn't think so...

No, my guess is that a lot more people would have got on the Bebe bandwagon had it not been posted in the Burg for the spies to publicly refute.


But nobody's answered my question, which is this: what possible information could a citizen post in the Burg that would cause or help exile a spy? Sam? Tenchi? Jess? Any ideas?

[Shane]

Let's compare Jack and Karl. Jack suspects Bebe, posts his suspicions of her IN THE BURG, gets engaged in conversation by her, sees her defended by several people (mostly other spies), and changes his mind. Bebe lives on. Jack is exiled the next round.

Karl suspects Tyson, doesn't say a word to anyone he doesn't trust, isn't perceived as a threat, acts when he needs to act, and wins the game.

Karl had to sway one person, Rodney, who had prior suspicions of you. Jack had to sway like seven/eight people. Which was harder?

[Shane]

Also, Jenna was one of the main people behind Leo's Exile in Spies 2. She had told me she was suspicious of him during the first Round, though then, it wasn't reasonable. She kept at it though. Every round she was more and more suspicious of him, and left all her information in Adriana and others. Then she faked her vacation, which is why she wasn't on during the time Leo did get Exiled, but in reality she was in constant PM contact with a few people. She may not have been on, but Jenna helped get that ball rolling on Leo.

[Reicheru]

Good point about Jack having to sway lots of people actually. Although the point I made about all six spy exiles having nothing to do with the Burg, and several citizen exiles being caused by it, still stands. The other thing is that there was plenty of evidence that Bebe was a spy, but the Burg stuff kinda took over and so the real facts seemed to get obscured.

BTW I'm honoured you're talking to me again Ally. Didn't know you were Shane, at all, although it's really funny reading our conversations in this game.

Ah, and I didn't realise about Jenna. Although didn't she say in her early confessionals that she DIDN'T suspect him? She didn't seem to actually do much confessing after that so I can't tell...

[Shane]

That's another thing too, when Jack had to sway people to Bebe, he had to do it with 33% of the cast being Spies. Yes, technically 33% of the cast was a Spy when you went as well, it's a lot harder when the Spies totals are higher, and you have to sway more people. You run the risk of hitting a Spy, and with like 14 people in the game, someone defending Bebe at that point doesn't seem very fishy, as it could just as easily be a Citizen.

[Shane]

I'm not sure on Jenna's conversations, but I do recall her saying to me a lot that she thought Leo was a Spy, and in the early game I thought she was insane, because I got no bad vibe from him at all. Then, after you guys recruited me, I was like "holy shit, Jenna's right!", but she seemed to be a loner...

[Shane]

But nobody's answered my question, which is this: what possible information could a citizen post in the Burg that would cause or help exile a spy? Sam? Tenchi? Jess? Any ideas?

It helps both sides. If people post suspicions on a Spy, naturally the Spy would know, and can defend themselves. But that's just it, anyone is going to defend themselves if they see they're suspicious, but just because someone defends themselves doesn't mean they aren't a Spy. In this game, it seemed like people forgot who they suspected if someone tried to defend themselves. People need to stick to their guns a bit more.

Also, if a lot of people have the same suspicions, it helps get a vote going early, so you have more time to look at everything without having to plan a vote as well.

There's nothing that will tell a Citizen, directly, if someone is a Spy, but the more information, the better, assuming people take it with a grain of salt. People need to remember that Spies can post as well, and not EVERYTHING is credible. The Burg can simple hold information, so when someone innocent goes, we can look back, together, over what they had said, and find something to go on.

[Judith]

I'm sure Jenna would feel honored to see you say that, Shane! However, wasn't Jenna on vacation when he was exiled?

[Trina]

I believe so.

I don't actually give Jenna credit for booting Leo. Sure she may have had our suspcions but like most spies game, we all have suspicions early on and don't act upon it. It was really EMP, like Reicheru said, that started the vote for Leo. Jenna just gave her two cents before she left for vacaation and didn't really tell anyone to push for it.

[Shane]

Yeah, her "fake" vacation...

[Bruce]

Tenchi - I seem to recall that you and Bebe rode on to glorious victory despite all the stuff in the Burg. Maybe if Jack had kept his Bebe ideas under wraps and we'd just discussed them with people who could be relied upon, the spies would have been unaware of them and they wouldn't have been dismissed so easily.

I'm taking a tiny part of a large post because I'm lazy ;D As for the idea that the spies wouldn't have known about the Bebe suspicion had it not been public.... I disagree strongly in the case of this particular game; Bebe was trusted by a large number of people throughout the game, and most of those who didn't trust Bebe either trusted Tenchi, Jess, Claire, or Raphael, etc. I think the spies would have known everything in this game regardless of whether it was public or not. Five spies is a large number, it's pretty easy for five random people to build up a vast network within the 20-something citizens.


As for whether public posting helps, overall, I think it can help the Citizens as a whole, but it definitely doesn't help the person doing the information posting... If you're a well-informed citizen making lots of long posts you're going to be both 1. Placed high on the Spies' threat list (for obvious reasons) and 2. Placed high on the Citizens' suspect list (Also for obvious reasons). So while Jack was putting lots of good information out there for us, he more or less sealed his fate because he'd either get exiled by the suspicious citizens, or if he was able to convince the suspicious citizens that he was to be trusted, thus reducing his buffer as a suspect taking attention away from the real spies; imprisoned by the spies.
Is that necessarily a bad thing, though? This is a team game; if somebody has to sacrifice their own safety to get the proper information out there where everyone can see it and it can't be altered or edited (That's a big deal because it's EASY to make claims about a citizen once they're imprisoned or exiled and not have to face the consequences of a lie), that's just a small price to pay for victory (Or at least a shot at victory ;D).

[Reicheru]

And so we're back to the old dilemma... take one for the team, or play for yourself. Now personally I think that as long as you're smart and nobody screws up, there's no reason not to do both. The citizens have to be imprisoned, true, but there are ways to try and make sure it doesn't happen to you.

In Spies 1, I effectively sacrificed myself. Knowing full well I was going, I told Soraya and Marion everything I knew in a chatroom the evening before imprisonment. Gindi, who knew Soraya and Monica were the counteragents, had something to do with it, because he wanted to protect them; but in the end, I think I was going anyway. I was too obvious a threat. They weren't. Was this good play on my part? No, it was crap play.

To take that a step further, I made it clear to the citizens before I left that the two remaining spies would be found in the Mercedes - Julian - DJ - Monica - Caroline group. (Again, I didn't know then that Monica was a CA or that DJ had been investigated.) Does that mean I was in any way responsible for Julian's exile (I'd suspected Julian strongly from the start) or Mercedes'? Not by any means. I didn't vote for them. I wasn't there when they were taken out. I WAS partially responsible for Gigi, in that I strongly encouraged Gindi and Soraya to form a voting bloc against her, but in the end winning the game for a citizen means exiling the last spy. I had nothing to do with this.

And I've said how much bollocks I think the idea that anyone but the two winners and perhaps Nicole contributed to the win in Spies 2 is, right in my post above, so I won't repeat that.

In this game, the winning citizens are the ones left standing when the last spy is taken out. The winning spies are all of them, regardless of which of them survives. This seems pretty fair to me. A spy can still contribute after being exiled, if he's "taken one for the team". A citizen can't. You might be really unlucky to be imprisoned late on, but unfortunately luck is part of any ORG.

Of course, if the spies win, the whole question of how "deserving" the citizens were is academic... we all lost, regardless of who was still alive.

[Arthur]

I don't feel like reading all this bullshit, but I should mention that Reicheru did a hell of a job at the end figuring out 4 of the 5 spies. Had Bruce voted with us, I think we would have gotten Tenchi, Bebe, Jessica, and Claire in order. Raphael said that he would have gone after Claire, so he may have been able to save himself somehow.

But anyways, Reicheru did very well at the end.